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place to be once they settle this thing. the third and the most important thing is the u.s. economy is the most vibrant, adaptable, innovative and creative economy on the planet. i think that means we're coming out and starting to see that in many sectors today. we're bullish and think you need to look at this on a positive frame. >> maria, i'm less bullish than that. that sounds very optimistic. i would love to believe that, but if you compare valuations of equities versus bonds, yes, there's a huge spread right now, but that doesn't necessarily make equities really cheap. it's just a relative trade. i think, also, yes, we're a vibrant economy. we certainly are a strong economy. i think it's really unsustainable, the level of debt that we have in this country. we have $1 trillion in debt. i heard an incredibly succinct way of describing this. rick santelli actually said it this morning about how you can't say you're cutting $800 billion when really $80 billion is really from wars that are just going away. that's not really a cut. that's taking away the addition. i think you need to
because the underlying fundamentals in the u.s. economy are clearly improving, and you also have a stabilization or soft landing happening in china at the same time. >> david kelly, what do you want to be doing here? what's your strategy for the fiscal cliff? do you think we go over it, and what do you want to do? >> for a long-term investor, you don't try and play this one. i agree with stephanie about the market probably going higher once they get a resolution. they will get a resolution. it's possible it could go into early january. i still think they're more likely to get a resolution done before the end of the year. either way, they'll get a resolution done. when that happens, then we'll resort to looking at the u.s. economy, which is strengthening a bit here. also, the extreme and relative valuations between high-quality fixed income and equities will push money towards equities. i would not run for cover here because of the volatility. i think you just have to, you know, hold your ground through this and hope that the market moves higher next year. >> bob, this activity at
to disincentivize the economy and being too restrictive and cut off growth. it would be easy if there was a right and wrong. everything is right here so it is a matter of judgment, what proportion you come back in these things. but i think both sides have to be touched in this, entitlements have to be touched and revenue has to be touched. >> that's the message lloyd blankfein is delivering right now to members of congress on the hill and what he'll say to the president later on today. >>> as eamon mentioned, the president will not only meet with mr. blankfein but a number of other ceos at the white house later today to sell that fiscal cliff plan to them. president earlier today out speaking about it. our chief washington correspondent john harwood is live at the white house with some details on that. hi, john. >> reporter: hi, sue. i echo eamon. i think wall street ought to pay a little bit less attention to the statements that are coming out every day because we've got a long way to go on this roller coaster ride. we've got a live picture of jay carney briefing at the white house right now. th
to focus on this major threat to the economy. i wish others had. it would have given us more time to fix this major problem. at least now there's a focus on one thing and one dangerous man. a man who is not elected. who has never run pour office and is standing in the way after potential economic disaster. he's the ideological godfather of the tea party. grover norquist has been the driving force behind the anti-tax movement. his goal, to take big government and, in his words, drown it in the bathtub. norquist's weapon is the taxpayer protection pledge, which was at one point signed by 95% of gop members of congress. >> can you raise your hand if you feel so strongly about not raising taxes? >> on the campaign trail this year, only one republican presidential candidate, jon huntsman, dared to cross him. norquist has clout. he's called the most powerful unelected man in america today. >> he signed a pledge, it's without congress. >> that pledge is for that congress. >> i'm not obligated on the pledge. >> republicans are jumping ship and supporting unspecified r revenue hikes to help cut t
economy and will her job creation in our country. republicans are committed to continuing to work with the president to come to an agreement to avert the so-called fiscal clef. one reason why we believe that we put revenue on the table as long as it is accompanied by serious spending cuts to avert a crisis. we believe this is the president's request for a balanced approach to this issue, and we are going to continue to work with the president to try to resolve this in a way that is fair for the american people. we all now that we have had the spending crisis coming at us like a freight train. it has to be dealt with. in order to try to come to an agreement, republicans are willing to put revenue on the table. it is time for the president and democrats to get serious about the spending problem our country has. i am optimistic. we can continue to work together to avert this crisis, sooner rather than later. >> good morning. last week, the president's chief political adviser indicated that medicare and medicaid are the main drivers of our deficit. i know we have seen this morning als
the divisions in washington are may be so large we will harm our economy and harm our problem as they fail to solve problems and work these things out. over the past year, we have been joined by 300,000 saturdays, 100 of the leading ceoas, and small businesses who have said we need fix the debt, that we know. but we wanted to create a different kind of campaign where we come to washington, and while you have so many folks on side saying, "don't touch this. don't touch this. take this off the table." suddenly you're left with nothing on the table to fick the problem. we wanted to create a broad-based bipartisan group to work with members of congress to come up way deal. over the past week, we met with over 50 members of congress. we had very productive meetings with both the white house and the republican leadership basically saying we know we need a plan that will be big enough to fix the problem and biexprs balanced, and we want to help you come to that-- >> schieffer: let me just talk to you, mark zandi. you're our economic forecasters. ent to just go back to the beginning to try to help
strategy? what do you want to do with your money in the economy does go off the fiscal cliff? >> yeah, we were worried about that back in september, october. so even though we like the equity markets going into 2013, we wanted to hedge ourselves a little bit, so we took money out of equities. didn't just put it into cash. we put it into three areas we think are still good long term. one is we talk about emerging market equities, but i like emerging market debt. these monetary authorities are done tightening. they fought the inflationary problem that they had successfully. they're in hoed. yield curves could shift down. we stress doing it in local currency. the other areas are u.s. high yield, which i still think is valuable. we do think spreads will contract and emerging market equities as well. >> jordan, what about you? how are you preparing for what could be an eventuality where we go over the cliff and we've got to deal with higher taxes and a slower economy? a lot of people expecting recession in 2013, if, in fact, this occurs. >> think about what works well in a slow-growth economy.
like republicans want? >> here is what is at stake. economy is on the brink potentially of going to recession. that will have the worst impact on the deficit that anything will. we got to make sure that the economy continuebes to grow. that is the problem here. i know democrats have this blood lust to raise taxes on supposedly rich people, which are really small business people. but it is not going to do anything to grow the economy. here is what president obama needs. he has to make sure the economy grows. he will be a two-term jimmy carter if the economy goes back in recession and we can't pull ourselves out of this thing. >> eric: i heard you laugh, martin on the "two-term jimmy carter" line. >> he doesn't want to be a two-term george w. bush that took us in a steep recession. >> hey, you are the one with the bush tax cut. >> this can be worked out. everybody knows that. you can raise rates a point or two, that is not going to be end of the world. republicans understand that. let's get through with the fear we have had a couple of weeks of theater and let's get down to serious
savings as part of that and invest in things that matter to the american economy. we think we can do that. we have a good chance to do it now. it's important that we do it. i think we're going to get there. >> given tough talk over the weekend, why aren't we waking up to down numbers, red arrows? >> europe is terrific. bond rates are phenomenal. a great run. china numbers are better. i think that there's a lot of people who feel like doug cast does who writes with me with a piece in "the new york times" saying that -- >> most stuff is nontaxable accounts any way. most stocks that people won't be as motivated to sell as people think. of course that doesn't necessarily deal with the increase in payroll taxes and the whole recession side of it. it does deal with the stock market side in terms of selling. >> why not say, listen, fiscal cliff, i have to cut numbers. i have to cut guidance. i think many ceos will cut guidance because of the possibility that the amt is going to -- this alternative minimum tax, people don't know they have to write a check for $3,500 at the end of the year. once y
. this is "the five." ♪ ♪ >> dana: congress 35 days to reach a deal and prevent the economy going over the fiscal cliff. no mystery what the issues are that must be reed. the democrats know, republicans know and so does president obama. entitlements are pushing the country toward financial ruin. here is what the president said in 2010. >> the major driver of the long-term liabilities is medicare, medicaid and healthcare spending. nothing comes close. social security we could probably fix the same way tip o'neil and ronald reagan sat down together and we could figure something out. that is manageable. medicare and medicaid, massive problems down the road. that's where, that is what our children have to worry about. >> dana: here we are, two years later and still no plan. on the left in congress refusing to deal with that simple reality. vermont senator bernie sanders caucuses with the democrats. take a listen. >> i get nervous when i hear the president and others continue to talk about quote/unquote, entitlement reform. which is just another cut for medicaid and medicare and social security. >> er
the economy is pretty well positioned potentially in 2013 if we can put this behind us. so i think a lot of what's going on is what you would expect to see in this negotiation, very public negotiation, which is not the best way to do it. i think at some point, the president and the speaker are going to get in a room and have some very serious dialogue as this gets closer. my view is that both the administration and the republicans would prefer to put a deal together, and the outlines of that are on the table. >> you talk about the cliff or the abyss? we need to separate the two. it would be nice to have like a bridge to that $4 trillion deal that includes entitlement, tax reform. in fact, i don't know why the president isn't talking about that more with the simpson-bowles. >> the president did say that he doesn't think there's anything we can get done. >> as a bridge to that. always talking about the high end. >> actually, joe, i think the administration wants to see a deal come together here. >> for what, the fiscal cliff or the fiscal abyss? >> for both. >> for both. >> so that a down
of an agreement that's good for the economy is if a group of republicans decide they're going to block and increase in tax rates on the wealthiest americans. i think it's unlikely they will choose to do, that of course, because there's so much at stake. >> schieffer: in all seriousness, i'm told mitch mcconnell laughed when you handed in this proposal. is that true? >> they're in a hard position, bob. they really are in a difficult position. and they're going to have to figure out their politics of what they do next and they're trying to figure that out right now. we're going to work very hard at this and we're going to keep talking to each other. and, again, i think we have a very good chance for coming together on an agreement that not just protects 98% of americans from a tax increase and protects the economy from deeply damaging upfront spending cuts and protects the med from leaving us vulnerable to, you know, periodic threats of defaults by politicians, i think we can do better than that and do something good for the long-term future of the american economy. >> schieffer: did you
's what our economy needs. that's what the american people deserve. >> the white house is also turning to social media in a new twitter hash tag to spread his message. >> today, i'm asking congress to listen to the people who sent us here to serve. i'm asking americans all across the country to make your voice heard. tell members of congress what a $2,000 tax hike would mean you to. call your members of congress. write them an e-mail, post it on their facebook walls. you can tweet it using th the #my2k. not y2k, #my2k. >> they showed support for cutting a deal with the president. yesterday the oklahoma republican repeated his belief that congress should start by locking in tax cuts for the middle class. >> in my view, we all agree that we're not going to raise taxes on people that make less than $250,000. we should just take them out of this discussion right now, continue to fight against any rate increases, continue to try to work honestly for a much bigger deal. >> if the president is willing to accept 80% of the bush tax cuts for 98% of the american people, i think that's a point we
office, bowles has a good reason for saying what he did. the economy would go into a recession, economic output would drop and unemployment rate would go back up to 9.1% by the end of next year. now, the clock is ticking. john and harry, get out of the sand box. 33 days are left. peter difazio of oregon is "outfront" tonight. let me just get a response from you about timothy geithner's plan that he put on the table. 1.6 trillion in revenue. $400 billion in cuts. i'm a little confused because the president said he will give $2.50 in spending cuts for every dollar in revenue. this is, this is the opposite. >> well, finally, the white house has learned not to negotiate with itself, but with the opposition, which is the republicans. remember, there is no real cliff. on january 1st, the only thing that goes away is the social security tax holiday and nobody is seriously talking about continuing that. all the other tax increases don't take place until sometime around march. gives congress plenty of time to rekrit them, but that's $4 trillion of additional revenues. so okay, we're going to cut
revenue. >> the economy is in a different position, the president actually did sign into law a series of cuts, he's proposed a lot in his 2013 budget. it's not like he's been stagnant. we've been having this argument throughout the presidential campaign and guess what? as we keep saying, americans said we're not buying it. the conditions have changed, the economy has changed, i think the outlook in the picture has changed. that's part of the reason the president is so firm about not going back to the debt ceiling conversation again and creating that level of instability and not bending on this issue of raisings the rates on the top 2%. >> yeah. i think -- >> go ahead. >> it's an important point. i think the american people are seeing that the president has already agreed to more than a year ago to that $1 trillion of cuts. that was 100% in cuts as part of the budget control act and he's always said we need a balanced approach. we can't do it through cuts alone. he has proposed additional cuts as part of the process but you need to have that revenue component to have the balanced appro
but the economy will roar back. maybe, just maybe, zombies for obama will realize he has no clue when it comes to the economy. or we don't double dip to the recession. and the debt dissolves to pay the way for the 2016 conservatives. take your chance and take medicine now. over the long run, better for the economy. >> kimberly: call his bluff. be strong at the negotiating table to make sure you can do what is best in interest of the country. these are tough time and you have to stand your ground. if you look at the recent polling, obama dropped three points. in polling with the gallup poll. people aren't happy with him anyway. >> eric: there is a counterproposal, around $800 billion in revenue through tax reform. they go through spending cuts. none of the spending cuts in obama's plan. are we so far apart we will go up or is there a meeting ground? 'canes is smart of the republicans. last week, geithner to the treasury secretary and laughed at. across the board, left and right commentators said i think president obama is overplaying the hand here. they have a plan to get him what he campaigned
the economy to go over the fiscal cliff? what kind of reaction might we see in the market if that were to materialize? >> well, if we saw the market sell off in a big way, i don't think anybody believes we're going to go over the fiscal cliff. there will be some sort of resolution. they'll come up with some tax cuts, some breaks in spending, and probably kick the can down the road on a lot of it. i love the way this market is acting. it's not selling off with all the bad news, all the bickering, all the bad words on each side. you've got to love the way that this market is holding up here. doesn't mean investors need to be carefree, but overall, it looks like the market is setting up with a lot of negative sentiment out there. looks like there's a lot of opportunity for a big run higher once we get some form of resolution. i really believe we're going to get it. >> you think by year end? >> i really do. i think they want to go home for christmas. they're not going to want to not go home for christmas. you can always count on politicians to do the right thing when all other options have
. whether it's the best solutioner to the economy is an entirely different story. this is a political and ideological argument and we'll see who wins. martha: there is a couple ways this could go. one is to land in the middle. you have $800 billion and $1.6 trillion. the other is for one side to say no deal. we'll let you go over the fiscal cliff and we'll see what happens. >> reporter: at the last minute i think there will be a deal. i think republicans will retreat and say okay, you can have higher tax rates but only on people making a half million dollars a year. the president will say, okay, but we'll only discuss -- we'll think about, we'll promise spending cuts in the future. it will be a way of kicking the can down the road. martha: charles krauthammer have a will the more leverage than republicans realize. the president does not want us to go into a recession. we'll talk about that coming up. bill: democrats are all about tax hike and republicans argue massive spending programs like medicare and social security must be dealt with in any kind of deal if you want to bring count
're going to talk about the fiscal cliff, we're going to talk about the global economy. we're going to talk about the civil war in syria. we'll talk about the royal baby coming soon. first we want to get right to zoraida sambolin for an update on the day's top stories. >> soledad, the fiscal cliff debacle, with 28 days remaining before drastic tax hikes and spending cuts take effect, a republican spending plan has been rejected by the white house. brianna keilar is live from washington. what now, brianna? >> well, right now it's about the pressure building and the clock kicking, zoraida. as house republicans in the white house try to ultimately broker a deal between two very different plans. house speaker john boehner's counteroffer, if you take a look at the headlines from this $800 billion in what would be savings from tax reform. so that is new tax revenue. but not done by increasing income tax rate on the wealthiest. but instead by closing tax loopholes, eliminating tax credits. and also $600 billion in health savings. that's what you'd get from entitlement reform. from reforming medica
wealthy americans are the ones who are creating the jobs and helping to turn this economy around. that remains the big sticking point. those bush era tax cuts, white house saying it should be extended for middle class americans but not for those upper income americans, carol. >> how seriously should we take these negotiations? both sides are negotiating in public, not the greatest way to negotiate in the world, right? >> reporter: right. you sort of have to take it based on the information they give you. there's a lot that goes on behind the scenes. we've seen this play out over the last four years where both sides will sort of throw these sharp elbows publicly, but then they do hammer something out. we do have to take it seriously. you have to get a sense that both sides understand the serious nature of this fiscal cliff and they do want a deal to get done. so they are looking for ways to find some kind of agreement. they are looking at outside groups today as well. the president will meet with half a dozen governors, arkansas, minnesota, utah, wisconsin, republican governor fro
yet, with whispers of possibly the fed stimulating the economy even further, and with economic data pouring in almost daily that suggests we're still sputtering along? >> well, i tend to think 2013s going to be a great year. i'm not just looking at housing and employment. i'm looking at the architectural building index. there's stuff in the draw room. they're ready to bid out this winter and break ground in the spring. the republicans know that. the democrats know that. i would agree with rick. right now it's hard to imagine they can come up with something. we know they can. we know the democrats can say, okay, we'll give you something on means testing entitlements and we'll move the social security age up. republicans will say, we'll get rid of second mortgage deductions. they can do it. i don't think they really want to do it yet. so we just sit here sort of up 100, down 100. you know, just stand on the sidelines and wait until they figure it out. >> ryan, how are you allocating capital as we watch these gyrations on a daily basis because of comments out of capitol hill? >> the bo
within the argument for the debt ceiling with s that we should enter the american economy into a becau majo v that i argument. it is long past time to get rid of the debt ceiling and the modified mcconnell/obama plan is as good a way as any to do it. it gives lawmakers a way it avoid a fiscal cliff or fiscal curve. it can end flirtations with fiscal suicide. that the last word. i'm ezra klein in for ed o'donnell. >>> the president has returned from his trip. chris matthews and "hardball" is next. >>> a no-brainer for boehner. let's play "hardball." ♪ good evening. i'm chris matthews in washington. let me the start tonight with this. somebody has got to break it to mr. boehner, your side lost. romney, remember him? he's the guy who ran on the rich man's platform. the hands off the big boys' ticket. he's the guy who said his fellow 2%ers have your back. mr. boehner, ye of limited memory, the voters looked this issue directly in the eye, they heard your guy, romney, playing palace guard for the plutocrats, and they said i think i'll vote for the guy who is looking out for the middle cla
this was for the economy. this is a multiyear low reading in the manufacturing numbers. we haven't seen a number like this since 2009. we haven't seen an employment index number like this since september of 2009, the last time it was at this level, unemployment, 9.8%. we have a nonfarm payrolls number coming out on friday. you'll be lucky to see a positive number in front of that. i don't see how the market overcomes that kind of thing. independent of all this jibber jabber over the fiscal cliff, the economy is in really rough shape now. >> it is. we're seeing businesses cut back, getting ready for the eventuality they see coming, no deal by december 31st this worsening. sam, how do you want to be invested in 2013? where is the growth in the economy coming from, if anywhere? >> i think the growth is coming from an improvement in the housing sector. i think we are starting to see a slowdown in the job loss from the government sector. so, i think we're going to be seeing a better than half speed recovery. so, you do want to be taking a balanced approach. we do favor the consumer discretionary at this p
ceo warns the cliff must get stalled or the economy could be stifled well into 2014. >>> even more dividends pushed into 2012. coach, american eagle moving up and oracle will play out three-quarters of dividends this year. >>> more strength in housing this morning. toll brothers earnings top expectations. we'll begin with the fiscal cliff. governors are set to meet today with the president and congressional leaders. governors are concerned about the impact of deficit reduction measures on their state budgebu. the latest gop offer would overhaul the tax code, raise $800 billion in new revenue but seek $600 billion in health savings, net savings add up to about $2.2 trillion over ten years. boehner called the white house's original offer la la land and it does appear that even though at one point bowles endorsed a blueprint like this, he's trying to distance himself from it right now. >> the president got re-elected. he's claiming he got re-elected in part because he wants to tax that 2%. he cannot go back on that. in the meantime, congress most of the republicans signed the grover n
on the economy running in to the holiday season. so we have the better housing numbers, up 3.6%. then we had a stronger consumer confidence number and we're seeing the best consumer confidence since, what, february 2008. let's put it in context. we're just in 73 territory on the digits. 90 would be where the economy would be if everybody was happy with their lot. and we're still some way away from that 90 figure. but apparently things improving on the fact employment is picking up. so it would appear that things are getting brighter for the u.s. economy, but, boy, we still need to bang some heads together on this fiscal cliff because until we're going somewhere on on that, these markets are treading water right now. back to you. >> all right, geoff cutmore live in london. thanks. >> what would you do with 500 pll million? >> i would say that's gambling and that when we cover the story, we ought to talk about the draw backs on people being taken advantage of and never get any money. >> t.j., how close did you get to becoming extraordinarily wealthy just this time last week? >> pretty close. o
to react -- >> the markets is not going to like it. >> we don't know. forget the market. the world economy -- my question is would the republican party like to go over the cliff hanging onto that 2% of rich people and say that's why they did it? can they live with themselves if they do that? >> in some ways the politics for boehner becomes easier, i don't like calling it a cliff, after you go down the slope or whatever you want to call it. >> why? >> because if nothing happens between now and the end of the year, all the tax cuts, poof, they disappear. you come back, the first week in january and you pass a bill, then the tea partiers, boehner can make the argument to them if they want to be reasonable, now you're voting for a tax cut. not for everyone, but for 98%. before that happens, the tea party people will say we're voting to raise taxes on the rich. if you let it happen on its own -- >> do you buy this, joy? that people don't get what's going on? they know what the mechanics of this thing -- >> let me finish one second. the tea partiers have to worry, some of them, about being chall
effects on the economy. the other area that democrats want to raise taxes are on investment income, things like capital gains, dividend income. now, those will jump significantly. here's the thing. very few of these benefits affect middle class workers. it does affect the higher income earners and the question you have to ask is will it affect their spending patterns and the thinking amongst democrats and among many liberal economists is that you don't spend the marginal money that you earn in the same way you spend the core money that you earn, so the impact won't be as big. it's not to say that there's no impact and it would be better for the economy if we were not raising taxes on anybody and possibly lowering taxes, but there's a doomsday scenario that's been put out there about what would happen if you raise taxes on the top 2%. we don't have a lot of studies to back that up. >> you say not a lot of studies to back that up because that is the principle republican argument. they say the recovery is so weak, if you raise taxes on the top 2% right now you will hurt the job creators at a
globally, but here in the united states we're getting answers from the national economy of society and nasa, the guys who put the man on the moon, that's where we're getting our information and where we're getting our policy guidance and the solutions to move forward. let's discuss it, the united states, if we have a carbon tax in the united states of some sort, we tax emissions so we have fewer emissions and you think that makes a really, rail big difference to the temperature of the planet? >> a huge difference because we've got to go after the industrial carbon pollution that's warming the planet and paying a heavy price. this pushed the price tag on the problem and we know where the pollution is, let's go get it. >> one last question, i'm sure you're familiar with the study by the britain's meteorologist office. no increase in the global temperature in a 16 year period. i think it was from mid 1990's until 2010, 2011. and that's what the british office said flat-out. what do you make of that? >> well, with great respect, i'm not familiar with the report. what i can say is here in this c
which means fewer jobs and that can drag our entire economy down. now, the good news is, there's a better option. right now, as we speak, congress can pass a law that would prevent a tax hike on the first $250,000 of everybody's income. everybody's. and that means that 98% of americans and 97% of small businesses wouldn't see their income tacks go up by a single dime. 98% of americans, 97% of small businesses would not see their income tacks go up by a single dime. even the wealthiest americans would still get a tax cut on the first $250,000 of their income. so it's not like folks who make more than 250 aren't getting a tax break, too. they are getting a tax break on the first 250 just like everybody else. families and small businesses would, therefore, be able to enjoy some peace of mind heading into christmas and heading into the new year. and it would give us more time than next year to work together on a comprehensive plan to bring down our deficits, to streamline our tax system, to do it in a balanced way, including asking the wealthiest americans to pay a little more so w
they were in 1980 or 1950, the question is given the world today and the other economies do we have a competitive tax system and i think our slow going economy under president obama says we don't. >> the new york times though makes a mention of, just a sort of a passing mention in this massive article, by the way, about the need to cut spending like one or two sentences about the need-- >> and i think that milton freedman brought us, that spending is really the tax bill. it's just delayed. so, every toll the government spends eventually they're going to have to take it from someone, either in taxes or in inflation, so, this is why you're seeing a lack of business investment is because this massive spending and huge debt tells every business owner, every investor, big tax are are coming to eventually pay for this. >> what was the point of the piece? i know there's hand wringing out there, maybe the folks on the right say under obama our taxes have gone up and we may more in taxes than we've ever paid and attempt to say, we're not-- >> this is long-term by the president and his allies
's comment was look, tax increases slow economic growth. tax increases take resources out of the real economy and allow the government to grow and grow. that's always a bad idea. that's not a good idea some years and a bad idea others. leeches, doctors don't put leeches on people ever, it's wrong. don't do it. it doesn't make people stronger. raising taxes, taking money out of the economy, damages the economy, kills jobs, reduces opportunities. >> you know, the latest cnn polls that just came out this week say you're wrong. two or three americans, including a majority of republicans, say the fiscal cliff should be addressed with a mix, a mix of spending cuts, yes, but also tax increases and if there's no deal according to these polls, they're going to blame republicans more than they blame the president. all the best evidence right now suggests the public wants to see the republicans compromise on this tax question. so from a political standpoint, is it okay for lawmakers to ignore the pledge that they gave earlier? >> well, the challenge is that the pledge that they made and that every two y
-in-class fuel economy. engineered to move heaven and earth. ♪ guts. glory. ram. jon: fox news alert for you now. we are awaiting remarks from president obama. he is pushing his plan to try to avoid the year-end fiscal cliff. this speech comes ahead of a meeting between the president and business leaders later today discussing actions the white house says are aimed at growing the economy and finding a quote, balanced approach to reducing the nation's deficit. let's bring in our panel. mary katharine ham editor-at-large of hot air.com and fox news contributor. peter mirijanian former advisor to the clinton-gore and gore-lieberman campaigns. when the president arrives at the white house to speak, he will have people behind him, ordinary americans who reached out to the white house and want their $2,000 middle class tax cut preserved. republicans are saying this is essentially a campaign stunt, a campaign appearance kind of event of the he won the election. he should get on the business of governing. what do you say? >> well, one quick observation, jon. i think what you're seeing, what i think is i
economy will look like in worker bees and retirement bees. >> now and -- >> you're playing defense here tonight. don't join us as a commentary. what's the story about your party. i see it -- i get increasingly aware, as you watch this show develop over the last 18 years in different forms, i get increasingly aware there's all white people at the table. a sunday show, for example, you get a sense, there's something wrong with this picture. do republicans have that sensitivity? talmage is -- >> she mentioned rogers, the number four people -- >> what do they do? >> they hold conferences every week. they run the retreats. >> run the retreats? >> john boehner -- >> you're getting in deeper and deeper. >> they run the caucus meetings every week. she runs the caucus, decides which speakers come in. vice chair of the caucus, lynn jenkins, virginia fox -- >> what's a more important position, chairman and vice chairman of the caucus or speaker of the house -- >> or committee chair. >> any of the committees. >> caucus chairman trumps the committee chairmanship. i've been both. i've been in the lea
. >> eric: it's not a bad call. this could be terrible for the economy and hurt jobs and businesses. but honestly, if you are ready, america, if you are ready, hold your nose, take a deep breath and take the medicine. it will fix the problem and the deficit problem as long as everything in the fiscal cliff happens. as long as sequestration happens it will hurt defense. tax rate goes up. eventually you will get someone out, to get that president out and get president who wants lower tax rates and congress that wants the lower tax rate and maybe a senate. it would hurt dramatically. best time to do it is now. >> andrea: there are two schools of thought here. one if you follow twitter or watch republicans who are on the pundit circle, they say let them go off cliff and let obama own that. there is another one that says just let him have what he wants and then when the economy nose dives he will have to own it. republicans are going to get blamed anyway. do you feel strong about either one of those? >> dana: not necessarily. i do think i see in "washington post," headline, obama offers
're not going to grow the economy if you raise tax rates on the top two rates. it will hurt small businesses. it will hurt our economy. >> reporter: the latest abc news/"washington post" poll shows the public is with the president on this debate. on this debate. 60% support raising taxes on incomes higher than $250,000. >> it's going to affect their standard of living very little, if at all, and -- the rest of us are being asked to pay for a party that we weren't invited to. >> congress doesn't do anything, then -- i have a feeling that it's really going to be devastating for next year. >> reporter: on other proposals, the poll shows the public is mixed when it comes to increasing revenue by eliminating the mortgage income tax deduction. but they decidedly do not want to see the medicare eligibility age go up from 65 to 67. >> it bothers me when they say it's an entitlement, when we actually paid all these years when we were working. >> i think it's very difficult for people to reach a compromise, which is unfortunate, because the nation is what suffers. >> reporter: democrats are also reluc
don't know. forget the market. the world economy -- my question is would the republican party like to go over the cliff hanging onto that 2% of rich people and say that's why they did it? can they live with themselves if they do that? >> in some ways the politics for boehner becomes easier, i don't like calling it a cliff, after you go down the slope or whatever you want to call it. >> why? >> because if nothing happens between now and the end of the year, all the tax cuts, poof, they disappear. you come back the first week in january and you pass a bill. then the tea partiers, boehner can make the argument to them if they want to be reasonable, now you're voting for a tax cut. not for everyone, but for 98%. before that happens, the tea party people will say we're voting to raise taxes on the rich. if you let it happen on its own -- >> do you buy this, joy? that people don't get what's going on? they know what the mechanics of this thing are. >> let me finish one second. the tea partiers have to worry, some of them, about being challenged from the right if they vote for anything re
that's wa ood for the american economy is that a group of republicans weade they're going to block e's increase in tax rates on wealthy americans. >> reporter: geithner says he's optimistic a deal is possible. even as a key negotiator tells bs news the deadline to reach 15tromise is december 15th. e foress needs time for the rocessative process to work. to the house and senate to pass presidentnd for the president to sign it by december 31st. >> right now i would say we're eportee. period. we're nowhere. >> reporter: calling the president's plan to avert the asking fiff a nonserious proposal. th ohe president is asking for $1.6 trillion worth of new revenue over ten years. twice as much as he's been asking for in public. excee stimulus spending in here wast exceeded the amount of new not ahat he was willing to consider. it was not a serious offer. > i think we're going over the cliff. it's pretty clear to me they've ode a political calculation. this offer doesn't remotely deal with entitlement reform and a way to save medicare and medicaid and social security from imminent bankruptcy
will have a fundamentally adverse impact on the global economy spent it's doing it now with china and japan. that's interesting, as you've got two of the biggest economies in the world in a nightmare situation that raises a fundamental question, and it's of ending this myth that economics draws people closer together. part of the title today is "mischief or miscalculation?." during the cold war, what was interesting is you can have 17 different spheres of contact with the soviets and if two and if to implement you it's about 15 others. there was a lot of heavy investment figuring out how to communicate and how to coordinate, how to deal with escalation, how do you talk about that. and in this era, when i look at the amount of time, particularly in the obama administration, even more so than the george w. bush of administration, you look at senior officials who go to asia, throughout the region, and also the discussion and attempt to courtney with china. there seems to be a lot of that to try to coordinate. but again coming back to jim steinberg was the fourth member of this panel would happ
weeks. it could send the economy spinning in directions. $1.6 trillion in tax hikes. he will travel to pennsylvania to sell it to you. republicans aren't buying it. listen to house speaker, john boehner. >> despite the claims the president supports a balanced approach, the democrats have yet to get serious about real spending cuts. >> democrats are firing right back at boehner. harry reid getting a little personal. >> i don't understand his brain, so you should ask him. okay? >> ouch. athena jones live from washington. same old same old. where do we go from here? >> that's the big question. the nice talk after the election is pretty much gone away. you mentioned one of the big sticking points, that's taxes. republicans and democrats can't agree on how to raise the tax revenue? end the bush tax cuts for the wealthy, close the loopholes, raise the capital gains taxes or all of the above. right now, they can't agree on how much money should be raised on the revenue side. let's listen to more from harry reid about the democrats stance on this. >> we are ready to protect middle class fam
on with speaker boehner? he went off his own cliff today. we'll tell you why he's ready to hold the economy hostage again. >>> and what's really behind john mccain's relentless and baseless attack on susan rice? former governor of new mexico and ambassador to the u.n., bill richardson, joins us live. >>> plus, remember this guy with the romney tattoo? he might just be the smartest man in the republican party today. >>> and we'll tell you what joe biden bought at costco today. you'll love this video. you're watching "politicsnation" on msnbc. >>> this is interesting. president obama is going to have lunch with mitt romney and you thought you had an awkward meal with your family on thanks giving. what i don't get is he said nobody should get a free lunch and now he's going to the white house to have a free lunch. [ male announcer ] with 160 more miles per tank, the distances aren't getting shorter. ♪ the trucks are going farther. the new 2013 ram 1500. ♪ with the best-in-class fuel economy. engineered to move heaven and earth. ♪ guts. glory. ram. ♪ ♪ [ male announcer ] while you're
that that would not be good for the economy. so i think we're dealing with a degree of artificiality right there. >> congressman keith ellison, thanks for joining us. >> any time. thank you. >>> for more on this, let's bring in our cnn political contributor and republican strategist, mary matalin and cornel belcher, democratic strategist and pollster with the obama 2012 campaign. mary, what do you make of the details of this opening bid from the white house? republicans have already dismissed it but does it give us any clues at all about what an eventual deal might look like? >> it's reported that mitch mcconnell, senate minority leader, burst out laughing when he heard it. it's not even worthy of a laugh. it's really sad, it's pathetic. we went from a reasonable theoretical $3 in cuts for $1 in revenue which was basically the simpson-bowles, and are now at $4 of real and immediate tax increases plus new spending for in the future unspecified, uncertain cuts to we don't know what. how could anyone take that seriously? i don't even -- i thought we were doing a kabuki dance. this is not a kabuki d
to accelerate economy in the first place, to reduce the violence related to the war on drugs, and also to create a stronger ties with the united states. the concentration is very specifically on the economy. they believe, the new president enrique nieto believes a strong economy, the creation of new well paid jobs will reduce the violence since younger people will have more opportunities in the country. so that's the focus, where the focus is. >> telemundo's julio viquiero, thank you. >>> this 47% have a different view about a different topic, this year's election. and -- >> controlled facility to bring these crazy bastards that want to kill us all to the united states. >> what drove this south carolina senator to call one group of people a name like that? all the answers coming up. you're watching msnbc. ♪ does that make me crazy ♪ does that make me crazy lega? at legalzoom, we've created a better place to handle your legal needs. maybe you have questions about incorporating a business you'd like to start. or questions about protecting your family with a will or living trust. and you'd like
about it except continually make the economy work while we let the liberals destroyed and then we come in every two years and fix it. but right now -- [applause] common sense is viewed as intolerant. the nicest thing you can say to somebody no matter who it is is to get a job. the nicest thing you can say. when you're walking down the street and there's a guy panhandling and you say get a job, you're complimenting him. you are saying that you have the will and the means to get a job. but now these days if you say that, you are seen as mean and intolerant to assume people have the power to act of their own volition. that is where we are at now, that we can think of ourselves as a person he can take care of themselves. you are a bigot. i never thought i would see compassionate conservative thing. do you remember that? the hat fell off. the compassionate conservative is redundant. being a conservative is being compassionate. it just takes the extra check for people to realize they're in believing something that is better for them. calling somebody a compassionate conservative is like call
it is not growing as fast as the economy over time that is a highly acceptable result as far as i'm concerned. and secondly, i would simply point out because revenues are the main bone of contention, i think, i would simply point out that it would be good to remember that in the past forty years we have never achieved a balanced budget in this country except when revenues were equal to at least 19.8% of gdp. and i think there's a lesson in there for anybody who wants to learn it. i've got some other observations, i would rare wait with them. >> thank you very much, mr. chairman. congressman frenzel you were the ranking member on the committee. you gave me a comment when i asked you to participate when you were in the minority in the minority but you did vote for the final package. i don't recall if you voted for the first package. i assume you did. welcome and thank you for your willingness to share your memories of that agreement. >> thank you. all the sponsors here, i'm honored to be sitting in a nice senator's seat with the luminaries who work so hard on that adventure, and first i think i
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